Re: [TVHGC Members] Vincent's Accident

Don't tell them Richard or it will all change.

Sent from my HTC

----- Reply message -----
From: "Richard Perkes" <riperkes@gmail.com>
To: "tvhgc_members@googlegroups.com" <tvhgc_members@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [TVHGC Members] Vincent's Accident
Date: Thu, Aug 27, 2015 07:44


Please don't worry about overcrowding on the island, it is almost never a
problem, if we have a really good day we might have 6 pilots in the air at
once!

On Wednesday, 26 August 2015, <robertager@ash-studios.co.uk> wrote:
> "Island pilots have a system whereby the first pilot arriving on a
flyable site texts it in and within 30min the site is generally full of
pilots."
>
>
>
> Probably a good example of where it is a good idea to let other pilots
make the decision whether it is flyable or not. The joys of telegram and
instant messaging are very sociable but not so great where site
overcrowding is an issue as I have learnt to my cost this year!
>
> Probably a lovely idea in countries that are not so densely populated as
the South of England!
>
>
>
> Robert
>
>
>
> Ash Studios: T: +44(0)208 844 1909 M: +44(0)7768 224444: Ash House: 34
Shelson Avenue: Feltham: Middlesex: TW13 4QU:UK
>
>
>
> From: tvhgc_members@googlegroups.com [mailto:
tvhgc_members@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Vincent Masi
> Sent: 26 August 2015 12:37
> To: tvhgc_members@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: [TVHGC Members] Vincent's Accident
>
>
>
>  Hi Francis
>
> The site was Brighstone around 1pm. Wind up slope on take off.
>
> I am off the opinion that any switch in direction may have been caused by
thermic changes in wind direction and I was just off with my timing when
coming in to land. Though that really does not explain such a dramatic
change in direction.
>
> Coincidently the plan was to spend the afternoon leisurely flying the
cliffs (reds) which were expected to be flyable later and indeed did come
on as we were leaving the hill.
>
> Island pilots have a system whereby the first pilot arriving on a flyable
site texts it in and within 30min the site is generally full of pilots.
Nowhere on the island is a site more than 30mins away in any direction
making flying here a real pleasure.
>
> Regards
>
> Many Regards
>
> Vincent Masi
>
> 8 The Bramptons
>
> Shaw Ridge
>
> W.Swindon
>
> Wilts SN5 5SJ
>
> 07850872896
>
> 01793 877713
>
> On 25/08/2015 16:28, francis rich wrote:
>
> Hello Vincent
> Glad you have no lasting damage.
> I was wondering if it was Brighstone or Limestone you were flying and
exactly what time of day. Those sites will sea breeze very rapidly. The
transition from thermic conditions to sea breeze is predictable from
evidence in the sky but only if you are looking and have prior knowledge.
Just curious to know if it may be that which caught you out? Indicators in
the landing field would not help if the direction switch was due to the
above since it can switch back instantly.
>
> On Aug 25, 2015 3:56 PM, "Vincent Masi" <vincent@vcs515372.plus.com>
wrote:
>
> Hi Francis
>
> To follow this through the site was Brightstone on the IOW, Neil sent me
a clip of my take-off today which showed that I launched ahead of a
incoming thermal (developing cloud ahead and to the left of take off) wind
up slope with a clean launch.
>
>  The problem may have been once the thermal went through (without me) I
may have been in sinking air during my landing approach this would explain
why I did not reach my intended landing spot, certainly the first thing
Eric said to me was
> that I should have come in from the opposite direction as the wind had
veered and I had not noticed.
>
> A wind sock would have helped but all in all it was my fault as I should
have Judged the conditions more carefully before coming in.
>
> I am a hangie with countless years experience so should have known
better. Normally when hang gliding I would put up a windsock as uprights
are expensive, other than Paddy I never see this as an accepted norm by
paraglider pilots.
>
>  It may not have helped but next time  I will put one up.
>
> Regards
>
> Many Regards
>
> Vincent Masi
>
> 8 The Bramptons
>
> Shaw Ridge
>
> W.Swindon
>
> Wilts SN5 5SJ
>
> 07850872896
>
> 01793 877713
>
> On 24/08/2015 12:50, francis rich wrote:
>
> "If there are ways to mitigate these risks, then I'd be interested in
hearing them."
>
>
>
> The thread began with an approach to risk mitigation that primarily looks
at the risk assessment of the site and how an average of low airtime pilot
might approach that. Given that Nik's accident may have had some causality
in his assessment prior to launching, it might be helpful to know on which
IoW site Vincent experienced his misfortune and whether there were any
prior indications he may have missed or been unaware of prior to launching?
>
>
>
>  I agree it is good to be prepared for emergency when it occurs and that
makes a good and useful discussion itself. Perhaps Richard may have been
drawing us back to the issue in this thread of our decision to fly and
whether there is anything in the site guide or knowledge held within a club
and its members that we can access but, perhaps, omit to?
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 12:35 PM, Paul Dowsett <
googlemail-personal@netaxiom.net> wrote:
>
> I tried to change the subject when I replied to Vincent, but I'm afraid
it didn't move the conversation to a new thread, Richard. Apologies for
that.
>
>
>
> "As always, tell me what accident you are going to have and I will tell
you what protective equipment you should be wearing/carrying ;-)"
>
>
>
> There are genuine concerns about emergency whistles not being effective
and equipment causing injuries, but I couldn't spot any constructive
suggestions about either of them in your post, Richard. ;p
>
>
>
> Large canisters are not practical and, as you say, could easily cause
injury.  I only did a quick search for the mini-horn; at least it is
small/pocket-sized, but I'm certain there are better, more suitable,
products out there (maybe you have some ideas?)
>
>
>
> Obviously, people will no-doubt use their common sense (without us
needing to spell it out for them), and not keep items in their pockets if
they have better places available.  I don't see a solution to flight decks,
instruments and, even, quick-outs (which are a safety device in themselves)
causing injuries, however.  If there are ways to mitigate these risks, then
I'd be interested in hearing them.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Monday, August 24, 2015 at 11:15:16 AM UTC+1, Richard wrote:
>
> All
>
>
>
> I would just like to point out that it was Nik's accident that kicked off
this thread and it seems to have moved on to the point where people are
suggesting carrying Air Horns etc in a convenient place in their kit in
case of emergency.
>
>
>
> It would appear that Nik's main injury, a ruptured spleen was most likely
caused by either his flight deck and instruments out his quick out
karabiners.
>
>
>
> Please consider what emergency kit you are going to carry, whether it is
accessible in an accident, and if you are going to carry it, if it could
cause problems in itself.
>
>
>
> As always, tell me what accident you are going to have and I will tell
you what protective equipment you should be wearing/carrying ;-)
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
>
>
> Richard
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 24 Aug 2015, at 10:09, Paul Dowsett <googlemai...@netaxiom.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Vincent
>
>
>
> I'm really sorry to hear about your accident and injury - I really hope
you are quickly feeling better.
>
>
>
> It's a good point that whistles may not be loud or noticeable enough to
alert people to an emergency.  A gas horn, as has been suggested, may not
be convenient, as I doubt it would fit in a pocket and may not be reliable
if carried, but not used, for years.
>
>
>
> I found this, which may be worth considering.
>
>
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plastimo-Mini-Trump-Emergency-Fog-Horn-/251588419411?hash=item3a93d69f53
(cheapest
here)
>
> http://www.baysidemarine.co.uk/index.asp?function=CART&ECD=34&productid=
>
>
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plastimo-Mini-Trump-Horn-safety/dp/B000WISPYS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1440406533&sr=8-1&keywords=mini+trump
(includes
reviews)
>
> All the best with the recovery, and I hope to fly with you again soon.
>
>
>
> Paul
>
>
>
> On Sunday, August 23, 2015 at 1:16:22 PM UTC+1, vincent wrote:
>
> Hi all
>
> Hot on the recent accident that happened to Nick I  fractured my wrist
last Friday during a landing attempt on a site I have flown a few times
before. (IOW) The simple truth to my accident was pilot error believing
that the wind was coming up the slope as per take off 30mins before, and
not realising until the last few moments that I was coming in to fast
possibly arriving down wind losing height quicker than expected and having
to land below ridge level.
>
> Evasive last minute turn and a rolled landing saved the day, all be it
with a fractured wrist which will mean a few weeks contemplating the
reasons for the accident.
>
> The day was thermic and a better pilot would have made more of the
conditions however not enjoying the flight I made the decision to land,
wind indicators in the landing area would have helped but as I had flown
the sight before I did not see any reason to suppose the wind had veered
that much and made a normal landing approach for this site.
>
> There were two other pilots on the hill at the time, one just packing
away as he had other things to do and another just watching not there to
fly. When I started paragliding it was suggested that a whistle attached to
my harness may alert others if injured, sound advice which I followed.
> When it became clear that I needed help,  I blew the whistle numerous
times very loudly eventually the spectating pilot came to my help.
>
> Interestingly no one had heard the whistle and he had only come down to
tell me everybody was leaving the hill. I guess the question is what more
could be done to alert others in these circumstances.
>
> Fly safe.
>
>
>
> Many Regards
>
> Vincent Masi
>
> 8 The Bramptons
>
> Shaw Ridge
>
> W.Swindon
>
> Wilts SN5 5SJ
>
> 07850872896
>
> 01793 877713
>
> On 19/08/2015 18:18, Tim Pentreath wrote:
>
> On 19 August 2015 at 18:06, francis rich <fra...@jfdiuk.com> wrote:
>
> I am unclear how those of us seeking site guidance are helped by being
told to fly if it "feels right".  That sounds similar to "take a punt" or
"what's the worst that can happen".
>
> Not at all. Imagine you're on holiday in Scotland where you can pretty
much take off from anywhere - you look at a map, see a hill/mountain that
looks suitable, hike up it, assess the conditions at your take off area,
maybe walk around a bit if it's a bowl to check the true wind direction,
and if it "feels right" (ie. on the hill, not too gusty etc), you take off.
Simples. No need for a site guide, compass or wind meter. If you're not
happy then you walk down again. If you're not experienced enough to decide
for yourself then you stick to regular sites where others are flying.
>
>
>
> Tim
>
>
>
> --
>
> flyAszent - Advance paragliders in the West Country
> Web: http://flyaszent.wordpress.com
> Twitter: twitter.com/flyaszent
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_...@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Member...@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_member...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> ________________________________
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_...@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Member...@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_member...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> ________________________________
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> ________________________________
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> <
https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/proxy/AVvXsEjun_55y92lvP_AqhJ31RLdPWnuAty3XZZag7BxZFtNJSabVbuE1Stq8d1i2E6k5VunbmvBkZSQkJB4YAJu8_Nnf471AnNCMdhWvBAdgaCzrZSY6cACZpfI7Na5PBaJJx1uvjWgQKSJyVtTSJcO242zRpaK=s0-d-e1-ft
>
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
> Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
> unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"TVHGC members list" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

--
Richard Perkes
01983 55 13 22
07990 52 06 64

--
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TVHGC members list" group.
To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TVHGC members list" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TVHGC members list" group.
To post to this group, send email to TVHGC_Members@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to TVHGC_Members-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.co.uk/group/TVHGC_Members?hl=en-GB
Please note that TVHGC may withdraw any posted messages deemed
unsuitable but does not generally endorse any posted content.
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TVHGC members list" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to tvhgc_members+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.